Home / Dating / Dating a Dutch Man, Seven Deadly Mistakes to Avoid

Dating a Dutch Man, Seven Deadly Mistakes to Avoid

Banner Lassus


The Seven Deadly Mistakes to Avoid When Dating a Dutch Man

Before telling you about the mistakes expats often make when dating a Dutch man, here’s a story about an incident in Amsterdam.

A female friend and sometimes running partner of the shallow man, was having a massage in a place in the Rivierenbuurt. She was behind a curtain, having a good massage, when she heard a voice in English asking one of the staff, “what kind of massage do you provide here?” The staff member responded “pressure point massage.” The English voice asked “what other kinds of massage?” To which the response was, “pressure point massage.” The inquisitive chap on the other side of the curtain pressed on. “Do you do body to body massage?” the voice of the staff member was now getting louder, “we do normal massage.” The English voice pressed on and finally got to the point, “what about a happy ending?” At which point the response was “you dirty man, you get out now!” Which brings me to the subject of today’s post, seven deadly mistakes made when dating a Dutch man.

The shallow man has met many an expat lady that have been on dates with Dutch men that have not led to happy endings. Several disappointed, international antelope, have asked me where they went wrong in their pursuit of the Dutch lion. The shallow man, is, as always, sensitive to the needs of his expat flock. Therefore, at considerable risk to my bespoke tailored three piece suit wearing self, I have put together a list of deadly mistakes to avoid when dating Dutch men. My advice will no doubt upset some, and if I am captured by a posse of angry Dutch men with lion king hairstyles and am forced to sit through hours of music from Tiesto, Fedde La Grand and Armin van Buuren, i’ll look into the eyes of my enemies and shout, sodemieter op,  jullie domme kakkers!

The things I do for my readers!

Dating a Dutch Man, the Shallow Man’s Advice

Dutch men, are probably the luckiest of their species on planet earth. I say this simply because, Dutch women, in spite of often dressing as if the Netherlands has a permanent power outage, and they can only choose what to wear in the dark, are amongst the most beautiful women that you’ll see anywhere in the world.

That in itself would be reason enough for every Dutch male to get down on their hands and knees and thank God, Buddha or Allah that they are lucky enough to be born here, but they have an even better reason to be blissfully happy. Dutch women are, in the opinion of the shallow man, the most predatory women on planet earth. The Dutch female selects the man she is interested in with the precision of a special forces sniper, aiming at a target.

The Dutch female is often not particularly interested or fazed by the fact that their target could be married, in a relationship or even as the shallow man has witnessed with his own eyes, have their girlfriend present. The Dutch ladies are relentless once they have set their sights on a target. This in turn has led to the Dutch male being one of the laziest when it comes to chasing women, as generally they don’t really need to. The antelope calls the shots and the Lion simply needs to drink his biertjes and wait to be hunted.

Because of this, expat women, often end up making the following deadly mistakes when dating a Dutch man.

Deadly Dating Mistake Number 1

Flirting. In many countries it’s quite normal during the course of a date to flirt with each other. Dutch men, used as they are to having antelope served to them on a denim covered plate, have missed out on this vital part of human relations during their development to adulthood. Dutch women, are often very blunt in their intentions and don’t waste time with such things as flirting. If a woman flirts with a Dutch man the likely response will be “so are we going to your place or mine?” no starter, or main course just a sprint through to dessert.

Deadly Dating Mistake Number 2

The shallow man is risking a storm of abuse by bringing this up again, but, I’ve been told repeatedly by expat women, even as recently as yesterday (thank you Vittoria) that Dutch men are tighter than a virgin female flea. When out with a Dutch man on a first date, you could be having a lovely evening. He may even have made an attempt at flirting, romance is in the air, everything is looking promising until……….., the bill arrives. The previously charming Dutchmen then breaks out into a cold sweat and looks at the bill, at you, at the bill, then at you again, and there is a silence so deep that you can hear the female mice in the cafe coughing. (Due to smoking, they are Dutch after all).

Do not under any circumstances expect him to pay your part of the bill. This is indeed a deadly mistake, if you are hoping to see your Dutch lion again, be a good antelope and suggest quickly that you’ll split the bill. If you are hoping for a happy ending that night, pay the entire bill, he’ll be so overjoyed he might even propose marriage.

dating a dutch man, money is their first love
The first love of some Dutch men

Deadly Dating Mistake Number 3

Due to the Dutchman’s love of money, they will not be impressed if during your date that you order bottled water or even worse San Pellegrino, which is the Ferrari of bottled water and is not cheap. Your date will immediately assess you as being high maintenance, while he drinks his glass of tafel water.

Don't order San Pellegrino while dating a Dutch man
Relationship killer!

Deadly Dating Mistake Number 4

Dressing up. The Dutch male is used to the fashion sense of the “doe maar gewoon normaal” Dutch female. In other words, denim, shapeless boots, a top that clashes so badly with the rest of the outfit that you’d think Stevie Wonder was their personal stylist, and hair that would make a perfect nest for any passing bird.

Don't do your hair when dating a Dutch man
It’s a Friday night, I’ll do my hair like this

If you, as an expat woman, turn up for your date, as is normal in most countries, in a nice outfit, stylishly cut shoes, makeup and styled hair, your Dutch date will have a minor heart attack. He is likely to ask you what that stuff is on your face, and if you are planning to attend a wedding after the date. The shallow man advises that on the day of the date, that you put your TV on Nederland een, between 7 and 9 and watch Vandaag de Dag. Look at how poorly dressed the presenters of this show are and simply copy them. That is what passes for high fashion here. Your date will love you and not fear for the money in his wallet. If you really want to make him feel comfortable, wash your hair prior to the date and don’t bother drying it, this drives the Dutch male crazy with passion.

disaster
Dress more like her for success

The Shallow Man

Would like to thank all of the ladies that were kind enough to share your tales of dating woe with me.

Stevie Wonder was not hurt during the writing of this article.

 

Subscribe to the Shallow Man on YouTube

 

Till next time, hou je bek!

About Simon Woolcot

Infamous blogger, annoyance and self confessed Shallow Man . Simon is a British expat who has lived in Amsterdam for over 11 years, and due to Brexit may soon be applying for asylum. As well as writing this blog, Simon also has a YouTube channel of the same name, writes and directs videos, and hosts seminars about life in the Netherlands

Check Also

Macho Russian man

Five Differences Between Dutch and Russian Men

The Shallow Man recently provided his readers with a helpful guide on five differences between Dutch and …

The Video of How to Date Dutch men

How to Date a Dutch Man The expat lady, Stevie Long, having learned how to …

  • Jennifer

    Overgeneralization! I certainly not behave like that as a Dutch woman and I most definitely have not paid the bill on the first date!

  • nkm

    Kind of easy to claim that every Dutch girl looks boring and if they did not put any effort in their outfits, don’t you think? Also, not every Dutch guy is the way you describe. Many of them do flirt and are not to cheap to split the bill. And about the antilope-story, I think it is the other way around. Try standing at the bar without being hit on several times.. Even if your boyfriend is standing next to you.

  • Lucy

    Well, funny stereotypes, funny text. But stereotypes are stereotypes, which means they’re not necessarily true for everyone. For example, I’m an expat girl and repeated times I had to insist to my Dutch boyfriend to share the bill. He says it’s not a problem and i say it’s unfair. Besides, it’s true that he doesn’t mind if we go out and I don’t have make up on, but he loves it when I put make up on as well (as long as it’s not too much, but I think any guy likes a lot of make up anyway).

  • Maria

    I really disagree with all this! I come from Malta and live here since 1998 and never had such experiences! These articles are complete rubbish!

  • Jerry

    I totally agree with everything! Couldn’t be described any better!

  • lot

    These guys are everywhere in the world. Search harder. maybe you are too excited to date the first guy you meet.

  • Ms Disappointed

    OMG, no2 happened to me… today! The bill for the coffee/tea we had on our (first, blind) date was a whopping EUR 12,50. He proceeded to lay down EUR 7,00, after a few awkward moments when he realized I was putting on my coat and had no intention of pulling out my wallet he galantly ‘offered’ to pay the whole bill, as compensation for being a bit (40 minutes) late… really?! How generous! :-p

    • Simon Woolcot

      I’m surprised you waited 40 minutes. I’d have left after 20 minutes. Life is too short to be waiting around for people.

      • Ms Disappointed

        ok, to be fair, he did let me know 15 minutes beforehand he would be 30 minutes later (and I was still home at the time), but then showed up another 10 mins later… But yeah, he started off with malus points, gained some bonus points during the date itself, but then lost them all when the bill came 😉

  • Sweety

    Very true, if even worst

    • Jerry

      Agreed

  • LK

    Haha! As an expat woman, i totally agree with mainly number 4! Dutch women have no style when it comes to fashion! Always wearing flat shoes such as converse or flat boots! When you see them at a party, they look like they come from work.. I was out in Rotterdam for new years eve. We were dressed for this special occasion like the rest of the world would do. Around us, men like women looked homeless. They never put an effort and girls dont know what high heels are. thats only about the style.. But i also think they are not the kind of people u wanna have smthg with.. They dont know how to share, money is too important for them and they can be mean if u dont speak dutch.so to me, no way to date a Dutch. Men are fagget and the women think they are the best. Dutch just dont know how to treat people with feelings and dont know how to take care of themself physically. Dutch women need a big relooking!

    • Monique

      LK, not every Dutch women is like that. I guess you met the wrong people 🙂

    • R

      I’m dutch, but I feel you. At new years, I was the only woman in heels and a dress. The worst. I wear heels almost every day, but people always ask me why I’m so dressed up. I hate it, so for the style part I totally agree! But the dutch are actually really nice. I don’t know who you’ve met over the years, but if you don’t speak dutch, most people are really appreciative. We get that Dutch is a rare, weird and difficult language, so most dutchies will easily switch to english for you. Maybe you should reconsider your opinion, because we are really not that bad. 🙂

  • Sookie

    Always thought I lived in the Netherlands, now I’m not sure.. Because nothing in this article seems familiar to me. Except for the fact that Dutch men always expect to get laid on the first date, but that is more often their arrogance than a Dutch girl’s intention. And the whole antelope thing was definitely bullshit, you were probably in the red light district when you wrote that crap

  • Lovin’ the Dutchman

    You know, I agree with a lot of the things on here, and of course I recognize that a lot of them are stereotypes and generalizations – “worst case scenarios”, actually.
    All of the Dutch guys I’ve dated offered to pay the bill, for example.

    But having said all of this, I really must say that Dutch men are possibly the best boyfriends you could ever have. The things like makeup, the lack of flirting etc seem so little compared to the wonderful things they bring to a relationship – honesty, loyalty and affection. When a Dutch man tells you you look good – YOU LOOK GOOD! He is not going to waste his time lying. When a Dutch man says he will meet you on Friday, HE WILL MEET YOU ON FRIDAY. When you tell him that his behaviour has upset you – he will do all he can to make it better. And when your Dutch man becomes the father of your kids, he will do whatever it takes to be the best father, and will want to be involved in their lives.

    They are indeed so difficult to catch, but once you’ve got them, you’ve got them for life. And you are a very lucky girl for it.

    • Marjorie

      This just cheered me up, that’s so good to hear! I read a lot of (hilarious) stuff on the shallow man’s articles about Dutch guys that had me worried…but this, this is rare! Men don’t know how to be men anymore… Wishing u all the best with u r ‘Dutchman’!

    • sourmaxwell .

      Are you married to a Dutch man?

  • R

    I hate it when guys don’t pay on a first date. Especially when the amount isn’t even that high. Once, I went out with this guy, we went for coffee, the bill was 6 euro’s (I mean, come on), and he said: “Well, you’re a feminist right? Let’s divide and conquer”. Naturally, he never saw me again. It has nothing to do with emancipation or female rights, but it’s a way to show well manners and etiquette. And frankly, when a bill is 6 (!!!) euro’s, guys, you just pay it, no questions asked. If you don’t have the money, don’t take your date to a fancy restaurant.

    I totally agree on the bad style, but I believe that both dutch men and dutch women don’t have style. I am Dutch, born and bred, but my god this country has no style what so ever. I live in Amsterdam, and there it is acceptable, but I have seen some bad style over the years. I went to the opera once, and people came in jeans, an ugly t shirt with a weird fleece vest over it! Really? Dress up man. Same situation has happened at weddings, parties, fancy restaurants, even at funerals. I have lived in Paris and Rome and you can really see the difference. Another example: flip flops are not shoes. If it’s hot, wear some nice leather sandals, but flip flops are meant to be used at the pool and at the beach, no place else. Italian men, for example, never wear shorts in the city, because shorts are for the beach. They always wear a suit. Dutch men would have a lot more game if they would have more knowledge of etiquette and dressed better, that’s all I’m saying.

    • Simon Woolcot

      R, Your comments are exactly the observations I’ve been making in my blog since the beginning. I couldn’t agree with you more.

  • I was affraid as hell when I first read this article haha! I was about to date a dutch guy (we are both living in Paris now) and it was the first time I met any dutch. But it turned out to be quite the opposite as you told here. Like, he always pays, he did flirt a lot during the first dates (and still does) and, well, I’m not going out with that messy hair like NEVER haha!
    Anyway I had a great time reading your blog, I wish I had continued blogging in english too so we could share information about dutch people and lifestyle 🙂

    Have a nice day!

  • Mimi

    I can totally agree with everything,have had the same experiences especially the men don’t have manners let you pay your and sometimes their drinks..If you are a good looking girl and like to dress up or different it can be really hard.People don’t like it if someone is different.

  • Mimi

    I don’t agree on their bad style however.I believe people are dressing better and better the last ten years.I like that they are no fashion victims and people dress comfortable.

  • rokokoli

    Ha! From my experience this isn’t true! I am an Euro girl(not dutch) and my dutch date paid for almost everything while I was visiting him. ( I didn’t expect him to pay and I wouldn’t expect any man of any nationality to pay for me) Furthermore, during my short visit to the Netherlands I have been approached by a number of men, so I fail to see how the dutch men are lazy and it is the dutch women who do all the work when it comes to mating as I didn’t even have to move an eyelash to have a dutch man standing next to me offering me drinks. And yes, they all thought I was dutch before I have opened my mouth.
    My current opinion on dutch people: Honest, reliable, good looking and have a great sense of humor. What more can you ask? 🙂

  • Tom

    Fashion is becoming better and better over the recent years, and if I’m going on a date with a girl ofcourse I think it’s great if she dresses up and puts some effort in! And I dont think, and know no who does, that flirting equals sex on the first date. Good to see in the comments that the girls who actually have some experience with dutch men think differenty, this author doesnt know a whole lot about dutch culture at all.

  • Tom

    Oh and as Rokokoli said, dutch men defintely have to put in the work with women and not vice versa. Other than that just the ‘dutch are cheap’ stereotype, whatever I’ve never split a bill with a girl in my life. But I suppose these articles are only vaguely based on reality at best.

  • Expat Lady

    I got tears running down my face from laughing so hard! Dating the Dutch is at best confusing. I keep trying but it’s very clear why so many expats get fed up with this good-looking bunch. What a shame!

    But you’re wrong about one thing: many Dutch women are indeed super beautiful but that’s about it. For the most part they’re UNBEARABLE and if I were a Dutch lion I’d do what many already do: stay the heck away from them unless I enjoyed being barked at by someone who carries herself like a crass low-class footballer.

  • E

    I must admit to smirking whilst reading this article. I visit NL often and this article is 100% correct. The men are gorgeous and have a really nice conservative dress sense – jeans, suit jacket and nice shoes. I love the Lion King hair. The men will not turn down an offer to split the bill if you offer – even if it is just a coffee. I recall my Dutch lover once telling me he didn’t like dating Dutch women. From my experience the women are jealous in nature, need better grooming, have big backsides and really need to stop cutting their hair so short.

    I can only provide my opinion based on what I experienced. Dutch men are gorgeous, hard work, stingy, drink and smoke too much and are arrogant. But as I said earlier so gorgeous to look at!

  • trumpetsandtulips

    Once again spot on! “if I am captured by a posse of angry Dutch men with lion king hairstyles and am forced to sit through hours of music from Tiesto, Fedde La Grand and Armin van Buuren, i’ll look into the eyes of my enemies and shout, sodemieter op, jullie domme kakkers! The things I do for my readers!”

    You missed one thing: they would probably repeatedly dunk your head into a giant tub of hair gel.

  • Di

    Your description is on point. You didn’t miss a detail. Couldn’t describe it better myself.

  • NN

    Although I enjoyed reading your blog very much but I have a different experience dating a Dutchman. My BF didnt ask to split the bill on our first date and not even in any Hang Out’s bills during our relationship. We experience long distance relationship as well and he even doesnt mind to bear the flight and transportation cost whenever I visit him. We’ve been in relationship for 2,5 years and now living together. Things Ive learned is that Dutchman is a honest person and very loyal, sweet attentive and very affectionate. Its not EASY to get into his heart. But once we win his heart, he will do everything at ANY COST. Or maybe Im just very lucky to meet the very rare Dutchman? Then reading your blog make me appreciate much more of his effort in dealing with our cultural differences as a mix couple.

    About the lion hair, well yeah, thats the true part. He reacted if I touch his hair because he doesnt like that lion hair to be messed up! :p

    Keep on writings! 🙂

    • Thierry Dumessie

      To split the bill for a Dutchman is also saying that he does not want to be in yor panties straight away out of respect many other man of other cultures who pay the bill do expect sometines a retunr investment.

  • I totally agree. I have been in the hunting game for while and as expat antelope coming from a warm country where the lion is king and hunts anything anywhere anyhow I see the issues an mistakes I made…ALL of the ones you describe at least 10 times. I would add that if you invite your date to your home do not expect him to bring a bottle of wine or a cookie or not even the wrapping of a candy…the Dutch Lion will bring himself and that should be more than sufficient.
    Also first move is a totally unfamiliar concept for the dutch men. You might as well walk around with a billboard above your head with blinking lights and that might not even work for them to notice you’re allowing them to flirt with you….

    Great post, shallow man 🙂

    • Simon Woolcot

      Thank you for making me laugh 🙂

    • Chris James

      the more I read this, the more I realise that I may be dutch more than I realise, and I’m born in the uk, oh if only I were tall and a looker! but sadly, I was repossessed before birth with the red celtic genetic! maybe in my next life, my body will fit my character!

      the flirting thing – yes, I think I would need a huge sign on the woman’s forehead saying “i fancy the living daylights out of you! feel free to just throw your arms all over me and kiss the absolute hell out of me!” but is that a thing that’s only required by the dutch? I think it also applies to men who aren’t seen as lookers also perhaps. but otherwise, this comment made me laugh also

  • Pingback: Essential Dutch phrases - DutchReview()

  • Supermasi

    Very true! hahahah Well… Im talking about 98% of them. They will never pay the bill., maybe a beer or two, cheap stuff you know; Do not wear watches because he can see the time on his cel phone! Extremely stingy. Inquisitive, curious. Very Poor dressed, Their houses are like cave mice. Very dirty. They will only talk to a woman if that day has won the Dutch team or if they are drunk! lol!!! AND…they just get horny in the summer and it seems your brother during the winter. To end a relationship use the word “”Clik”, Im sorry but i dont feel the click between us, (Heeeloooo I’m not a lamp)and the top: handsome dutchguy remove food from teeth with their fingers!!! oh my gosh!!

    • Blob Loblaw

      Haha! Not feeling the “Click” is the Dutch way of saying they don’t feel the “spark.” Both, I guess, could be lamp-related.

      But really it means that your personalities don’t fit together. It’s like two mismatched puzzle pieces. You don’t “click” :p

    • Thierry Dumessie

      Untrue I always pay all the bills, she never paid a penny. 12 years later and 5 kids hmm she never does 😉

  • American gal

    One of my great guy friends is Dutch and every time I or any of our girlfriends wore makeup he would ask what was on our faces and why it was on our faces and try to wipe it off lmfao!! It’s true they aren’t so keen on the idea of makeup. They like the au natural look 😉

    • Thierry Dumessie

      The Dutch like to know how you really look in case they have to wake up next to you 😉

  • It described me completely. I am afraid my Dutch genes are working on me more than I expected they would work. Thanks to great-grandpa who kept, and transmitted some of genes he received through our relatives that arrived here XVIIth century.

  • IHVJAEX

    I am not greedy at all. In fact, I frequently suggest to my friends I would pay the bill in full this time, you’ll get it the next time (Although I know that it’ll be the same the next time). That’s why it is so hard for me, to find friends, which I can rely on. The people here are seriously greedy, and it bugs the hell out of me. I would give away my last Euro, if that means I could help a friend, but most of them would not return the favor (Luckily I never have to loan money or something as I earning plenty, but still). Like my sister, she could easily say no, even if I say to her, I am all out of money, and I need money for food. She will simply reply with “Ik heb echt geen geld meer.” or “Waar heb je dat dan voor nodig?” “Ja maar sorry, ik heb zelf bijna geen geld meer”. Then I see her go the same night she refused to loan me money, to a bar XD. All that said, I have found a hand full of people that aren’t like that. One of them is half French, the other fully Dutch, like me. Most people on my mother’s side of the family aren’t greedy either. I guess I am different from the average “Dutch” Joe. I also want to add that I do like women who have fashion, I rather date a foreign girl. Hell, I married a foreigner.

  • Pingback: Netherlands Dating Show | Cuties Live()

  • Pingback: How To Attract Dutch Men()

  • MrMdK

    The part about not knowing what make up is, is ofcourse bullsh*t.

  • Pingback: » Essential Dutch phrases()

  • Niaomi Nitisha

    Wow! I have a date with a dutch man on the weekend and I don’t know what to make of this article. I printed it off and gonna share with him for some fun. We’re in the UK and he’s been here for 5 years. We’ve been chatting online for a bit and he seems just lovely. “R” you cracked me up so much with your comments LMAO And the fact that you’re Dutch made it even more hilarious… I guess you know for sure. Thanks for such an interesting read(and the comments!)

    • Actually, I’m not Dutch, I’m from the UK 🙂

      • Thierry Dumessie

        You aint Dutch, you aint much…. Lets talk abt British blokes, disappears to the pub or football shows up for diner and disappears again with his mates to the pub… etc etc 😉

    • How did the date go?

  • Jacqueline

    I started checking out this blog because a Dutch guy had just asked me out. Now that the date is over, I have to say the Shallow Man has been spot on on so many points.

    First off, the positive stuff about this Dutch guy – he’s educated, well read, tall, pleasant looking, has a healthy ego and didn’t try to dominate/act macho.

    Now the bad stuff:
    (1) Tactless / low EQ. In 2 hours, he’s already said 3 things that were offensive. This guy didn’t mean any harm, but he was direct to the point of being rude. And he had no awareness of how he came across.

    (2) Not gentlemanly. After reading what the Shallow Man said about how tight Dutch guys are, I pulled out my wallet after dinner. This guy allowed me to pay. Now, this guy is doing very well financially. He’s in management level in a global consulting firm. And he couldn’t even treat me to a cheap meal in a cafe. Alright, a date is when you treat the girl. A friend’s outing is when you each pay for your own bill. Since he sees me as a friend, I’m putting him straight into the Friend zone. He asked for it.

    (3) Commitment phobia. Now, I know that Dutch guys are happy to just have a live-in girlfriend, and that marriage is not something they are keen on. But this is not acceptable in my culture. So he’s out.

    It’s funny how right the Shallow Man was on Dutch guys. Despite all the good qualities of my Dutch date, I just do not see myself going out with him again.

    • I guess dating Dutch guys isn’t your cup of tea. He sounds like a good catch with the positive qualities you mention. As for the bad stuff:

      1) This actually works both ways. I’ve once had a date with an American expat lady who was actually a few times pretty offensive to me. Cultures clashing can result in strange things. But as a whole the Dutch are indeed more direct than other cultures, which can be seen as offensive, even tough it’s not meant that way. If you want to date Dutch guys, this is something you’ll have to see through.

      2) If you want to pay, then why wouldn’t you pay? We are all equal. I think the Shallow Man has not prepared you enough for this one, since there are basically two reactions you can expect. Firstly of course the one the Shallow Man has already mentioned: guys who expect you to pay (partly) the bill. On the other hand, there are the guys who are prepared to pay the bill. But well, if you want to pay, why not? You can always split the bill, but if you are the one offering to pay, he’s not going to stop you. Emancipation at its best.
      A date is not something you treat a girl, it’s something where you discover if you want to continue together. If you think it’s all about giving free stuff to girls, you are a leech, which is pretty offensive and culturally not acceptable over here.

      3) Here you are mistaken: not getting married isn’t the same as a commitment phobia. There are other ways to bind yourself, like a samenlevingscontract, or in English: cohabitation agreement. In a country where a lot of people turn their back to the church, this isn’t surprising at all. As an atheist I’m not sure if I would marry at all: definately not in a church, that would make me a hypocrite, and for the law… well, we’ll see. I think a samenlevingscontract and mutual trust will be a better basis than the altar.
      But if you really want to find a guy who is into marriage, I would suggest you look into the religious scene. I’ve got some religious friends who got married or want to marry once they find the right girl. Even tough a lot of churches have old people and are empty, there are some protestant movements (for example the Pinkstergemeente) who have a steady influx of young people. Or you could look into the muslim community: most moslims I know are pretty keen on getting married.
      And let me say to you: suggesting that not wanting to get married equals commitment phobia is actually pretty offensive.

      I hope you’re not basing your opinion on all Dutch guys on this one date you had. Maybe if you look more into the religious scene, you don’t pull out your wallet immediately but see what’s appropiate (let him pay, split the bill or pay it yourself) you can find a nice guy who wants to marry you. And maybe after a few Dutch dates you’ll end up like the expat lady in the Shallow Man stories: that’s fine too, you can marry her over here.

      • Jacqueline

        All I can say is, THANK GOD I DON’T LIVE IN HOLLAND, I am still attractive and I still get dates from men from other nationalities.

        • Thierry Dumessie

          Sounds like a blessing for Dutchies, you really sound like a possesive suffocating asian woman whilst being so called submissive. I met a lot of Indonesian woman in Indonesia did not even bother to date any of them, because before you knew the whole family was involved and being dragged to the altar. Dutchman like strong woman, who can give positive or negative feedback and are willing to speak their mind, you would probably not dare and just use innuendo’s or inklings. Ho wmany times in public places I was asked Kamu oeda kawin……once a week is funny several times a day is irritating.

      • Jacqueline

        But to answer your points:

        (1) I always laugh whenever someone says “I am just being honest” when they are being rude. Obviously, such people don’t possess EQ and don’t understand why there is a need for it. Blurting out the first thing that comes to your mind, no matter how socially inappropriate it is, is… a way of thinking that the whole world revolves around you. The feelings of other people don’t matter, the only thing that matters is that you got to speak your mind. You can be critical of other people, but if someone criticizes you back, like for being rude, that would be unacceptable. But of course, I doubt you can see the irony, only how right you still are.

        (2) I was giving my date the opportunity to define whether he saw this as a friendship or a courtship. Obviously, the Dutch don’t recognise the concept of courtship. And the idea of being generous is alien to them. Even among my female friends, we treat each other sometimes, and we don’t think of it as the other person owing us. Equality has robbed Dutch guys of their finer qualities.

        (3) If you want to insist on your “Dutch ways”, then stick to dating Dutch girls. But don’t complain afterwards that Dutch girls emasculate you. The rest of the world is not missing anything without you as the knight in shinning amour. We are too happy dating other guys, and treating them like the king they are for respecting us as their princess.

        • Ah, I was under the assumption that you were an expat living in the Netherlands, and having a date with a local Dutchie. But apparently it’s the other way around: your date was the expat in your country. I’m sorry about that. This changes a few things: since he’s wading in another culture, he should have adjusted to the cultural norms of his host country. Of course you can’t fully hide your origins, but you can at least attempt to blend into the new culture you are now in, and thus learn the dating rules of that country when you are going on a date there. In this case your Dutch date was at fault, since he didn’t heeded your cultural dating norms. Were you over here dating a local, it would have been the other way around. This doesn’t mean the local shouldn’t be considerate of the other, but it means that the foreigner should be more aware of the local customs. So your Dutch date should have paid since that is your local cultural norm.

          And let me get back at your points:

          1) Blurting out the first thing that is on your mind isn’t the same as being direct. You are confusing two things here. One of my friends chatters a lot: he blurts out whatever comes to his mind. Another friend of mine carefully weight every sentence, and says only what he really wants to say. But both can be very direct. I noticed on my travels and with my international friends that both types of talkative people can be found in any culture. And I can say that they do possess an EQ. But on the directness we can agree that the Dutch in general are more direct than people of other cultures. But that isn’t a result of egocentrism: most of the time it’s honest interest. For example, if you told a Dutchie you bought a new house, he (or she) could ask you how much you paid for it. He wouldn’t ask this because he thinks the world revolves around his ego, but because he’s honestly interested. In the UK this can be seen as an offensive question (this happened to a friend of mine who migrated to the UK). This is exactly what I mean with clashing cultures. What someone perceives as rude, can be perfectly normal for another person. Here in the Netherlands we live in a culture where we are very direct to each other, hence that honest interest in other people can result in direct questions. And this doesn’t have to be critical of someone tough. Of course there are people who are rude even to the regular Jan over here (not a lot of Dutchies called Joe).

          2) Like I said, I hope you don’t take your one date as a generalization for everyone in the Netherlands: that would be like saying that all Americans are fat, all Russians are drunks and all Belgians are dumb (none of these is true). The Shallow Man has pointed out with humor that courtship is different over here, I can wholeheartedly agree on that. Directness is part of our culture, and thus of our dating scene. But generosity is actually big over here (when looking at charity donations, according to the Charities Aid Foundation the Dutch rank among the most generous in the world): it’s just different. The fact that someone doesn’t pay for your drinks when you offer to pay them, doesn’t mean they aren’t generous. Over here we treat each other also: it’s not always going Dutch-style. Equality has brought the same opportunities for woman as for men (although we’re not fully there yet), which shaped the dating landscape too. that combined with centuries of directness, leads to the current situation.

          3) I do hope you see the irony of your sentence here: you seem offended when a Dutchie tells you his view about marriage, but at the same time you insist on your ways. Marriage is something you’ll have to work out together. Take for example the marriage between a Christian and a Muslim person. Or a friend of mine, who doesn’t believe in God, but did marry in a church because his girl does believe and wanted their marriage to be sealed over there. The things people do out of love :). When you really love someone and that person really loves you, you work out a middle way you both find satisfactory, despite the original views and intentions. I would wonder why you would bring up marriage on a first date if you hadn’t implied before that it’s such a big deal for you: it sounds like asking someone you just met for their favorite sex positions (yes, this has happened to me).
          As for your accusation: I’d prefer an independent woman who doesn’t need a man in her life but chooses to have one over a girl who fancies a king and expects to be treated like a princess. That sounds like a horrible relation to me personally, but well, everyone has their own wishes.

          I think we can agree that we would never date each other :).

          • Jacqueline

            My Dutch date was hopeless with dating customs, even though he had no excuse. I’m Asian. His ex wife is Asian. His last girlfriend before meeting me is Asian. You’d think he’d know how the date was supposed to go. I don’t know why these ladies consented to go out with him a second time, and how one even went on to marry him. If you have an Asian fetish, play by Asian dating rules. If not, stick to the Dutch ladies. Always insisting on your Dutch ways with Asian ladies leads only to a break-up or divorce.

            Back to the points:
            (1) Sorry but you don’t understand what EQ is. According to thefreedictionary.com, emotional quotient is “a (notional) measure of a person’s adequacy in such areas as self-awareness, empathy, and dealing sensitively with other people”. You can’t have EQ if you lack awareness of what is socially appropriate, even when dealing with foreigners. It IS ego-centric to insist Londoners have to accept your directness just because that’s how the Dutch are. The world doesn’t revolve around us, other people’s thoughts/feelings/customs are just as important as ours. If you want other people to be your friend, then sorry, you have to adjust to them, not insist that they adjust to you.

            (2) The Dutch are generous? I wouldn’t have guessed it from the aggressive way you went on and on about women paying for themselves on first date. Maybe some Dutch people are generous, just not you? Sorry hoor, I am just being direct! 😉

            In my culture, we don’t think of it as every man for himself. We think of it as a blessing to have friends and to be loved by them. In all the places I’ve worked in, we always share snacks, cakes, cookies etc. We treat our friends when we celebrate special occasions, and buy normal/platonic friends birthday dinners. It’s not unusual for friends, even among the girls, to get each other a coffee/drink when we hang out. So you can imagine why we find it surprising that when a guy asks us out, he would start counting every cent.

            Seriously, the best way to save money is to stay at home. Why have friends, or even a wife, when you can have a large bank account?

            (3) Actually, it was my Dutch date who brought up the issue of marriage, not me. He said, “You don’t have a deadline for getting married, do you?” I nearly choked on my pasta when he said that. Apparently, the last girlfriend he had before he met me, wanted to get married within a certain time frame. I don’t know why he thought I was the same. But given the nervousness in which he spoke about marriage, I’m really not interested in seeing him again. In my culture, marriage is the natural step after dating. If he doesn’t see it that way, no problem, we would both be happier if he stuck to dating Dutch ladies.

            I understand that in the Dutch culture, it’s all about equality. Making the other party feel special, like treating them like a King/Princess even for a day, is an alien concept. No wonder the other nationalities find Dutch guys so dull, so unromantic, so blah. I don’t feel I am missing out by not dating Dutch guys, and I don’t think I am the only person out there who feels this way!

          • With what you tell about your date, I agree with you. He’s in an Asian country dating Asian women, even having been married to an Asian woman: by now he should definitely be aware of the local customs, and act according to them. Just like you’d have abide to the Dutch dating rules when you’d date a Dutch guy in the Netherlands, he should adjust. No, he should have been adjusted already.

            Hah, time for the points!
            1) I actually mentioned my friend who migrated to the UK (Manchester, by the way, not London) to illustrate how a question with an honest intention, which is acceptable in one culture, can be seen as offensive in another. This has nothing to do with him wanting to force his Dutch habits on his new British colleagues, but everything with him being unaware of a social taboo. Don’t tell me you’ve never on your foreign travels run into a situation where you weren’t aware of some social taboo or cultural difference that made your behavior seem strange in the eyes of the locals (if you talk like you write, I can assure you that you will be seen as offensive over here, but that doesn’t imply that you’ve got a low EQ). I agree with you that other people’s thoughts/feelings/customs are equally important, but I also think that the guest should adjust to the host (but without losing his or her own identity, while still being considerate of the other). This means that your Dutch date should have adjusted to your local customs. He could still be Dutch, which might lead to some strange quirks, but he’s the guest (and has been for a long time apparently, giving him no excuse) and should act accordingly.

            2) I didn’t find my explanation of this custom aggressive, and it wasn’t meant to be that way. I apologize for the misinterpretation that it has caused. On the other hand, I found your responses pretty aggressive. It’s pretty funny how we interpret things differently. And with that, I think our definition of generosity also doesn’t match up. Voluntary work, having homeless people sleep at my house in a dire time, helping friends and family with their new houses / writing job applications / helping set up their business might sound alien to you, but I do count it among the generous feats. And it’s funny you mention the birthday dinners: over here it’s actually the exact opposite. The Shallow Man has mentioned it before, but over here you treat others with pie on your birthday. And getting something for friends is only natural. One time you pay, the other time the other. The same applies to dating: one time the woman pays, the other time the man, sometimes you go Dutch (like I said). If you offer to pay, then you pay, regardless if you’re a woman or a man. Next time will be the other way around. I think I found the big difference between both our expectations at the end of a date: you expect the man to pay (or do you expect the one who asked the other one out to pay, meaning that you would pay if you’d ask a guy out?), while I expect the one who offers to pay to pay. So if you followed the Shallow Man’s advise and preempt me by offering to pay, I’d let you. Next time the treat’s on me. The thing I can’t stand is the expectation that one gender must pay, regardless of anything.

            3) Seriously? He brought it up? What a dumb fuck. I can imagine that you were baffled by his words. Even tough our views on marriage differ, I think that we can agree that he acted pretty stupid there. If a girl would have brought up marriage on the first date she wouldn’t see me again. It’s not something you normally do.

            Treating the other like a king/princess is actually not an alien concept: it’s a discarded concept (ok, I’m exaggerating here, but still, it does touch some truth behind the culture over here). But since your core values differ so much from the ones the average Dutchie has (as the Shallow Man also illustrates with his stories), I think you make the right call when avoiding future Dutch dates.

          • Jacqueline

            Ok I’m glad we are in agreement on my Dutch date needing to adapt to the culture of the country he’s in.

            Back to the points:

            (1) I am amused by what you have said – that being direct is OK if it’s with an honest intention. Of course, we all have put our foot into our mouth at some point in our lives, particularly with foreigners who have a different reference point when it comes to certain things. But just because you are “honest” doesn’t mean it’s OK to be rude and tactless. People are offended when you belittle them, make them feel bad about themselves or invade their privacy. Just like in the Expat lady story, when she was told by
            the Estate Agent that she is old, and by The Koen she looked like a prostitute.

            Some things are better left unsaid, and being “honest” is beside the point if it serves no other purpose than to hurt/embarrass other people. Again, it’s not all about you and your need to be “honest”, but about needing to get along with other people and have them enjoy being around you.

            About asking about the price of someone’s house,
            I don’t know why people ever bother. I live in a developed country in Asia, but people can still be quite money minded. But even in my country, it is rude to ask people how much money they make and how much they spend on this or that. Why is there a need to compare? Especially if one side will eventually feel worse off in this little competition of “who has more money”? Again, it’s about
            making people feel belittled and invading their privacy.

            Sometimes, I don’t understand the Dutch’s
            obsession with money.

            (2) Thank you for seeing my point of view. I understand you weren’t aggressive on purpose. However, I was. Because I was tired and annoyed.
            I felt you were very stubborn, and reacted in a manner that I felt would carry my point across more effectively.

            On generosity, I agree with you it can take many
            forms. But I don’t understand why Dutch people like you are willing to be generous in so many ways, just not financially. I’m not rich but I have a job that pays
            OK. If I buy a friend a coffee, or a lunch, it doesn’t create a dent in my bank account. I can still pay all my bills and have extra money after that for other
            things. There is no need for me to count every cent, or be obsessed about what other people supposedly owe me. Life is too short to stress over these. What
            matters to me at the end of the say is that I am rich in friendship. I could always count on help, support and a listening ear when I need it. And when I am
            popular and well liked, it is easier for me to get a promotion or attract a quality guy. It all balances out somehow in the end and there’s no need to be calculative.

            On dating, I agree with you that it shouldn’t be
            one side paying all the time. But in many cultures, including mine, the guy should pay if he was the one who asked the girl out. After that, both the girl
            and guy should take turns to pay.

            It’s all about courtship, which is an alien
            concept to the Dutch. Actually, I am surprised my Dutch date even initiated anything. It took me a few messages to realise he was romantically interested
            in me, because he talked about nothing in particular and didn’t ask me out. Eventually, because I encouraged him, he asked if we could “spend some private time together” without the rest of the gang. LOL. For a tall and cute guy, he sure was shy! If I was in Holland, I’d probably need to hunt him down, get him drunk and then tell him he’s coming back to my place tonight.

            (3) To be fair, he was a disaster as a first date, but not bad as a friend. We’ve remained in touch and had a few nice intellectual conversations since. It’s a nice change from all the guys in my country who feel the strong need to dominate. He still says the wrong things sometimes. But these days, I just tell myself that he didn’t mean any harm when I feel like taking offense. My friends have all said that I should give him some more time and see how it goes, because of his other good qualities. We get along, but the
            attraction on my side is on the low side. The lack of courtship and romance is a killer, no matter how “nice” he is. Who knows, he might run into another
            Dutch /Scandinavian /Nordic girl one day who is perfect for him?

          • Margaret A Commonbottom VI Esq

            You need a British man

          • VolensEtValens

            It is impossible to satisfy everyone’s feelings and madness to try so, for the fact that one can never please everyone. People should be themselves and let others be themselves and when their views differ they should not get all offended and just let it go if possible, and if not, then part ways. The guy was being himself, period. You can’t condemn someone for being themselves and not twisting their personality to satisfy someone else’s feelings.
            Your views and his seem too different to come to an agreement. Perhaps you should avoid dating Dutch?

          • Binnendijk Ruth

            Very typical response of dutchie toché

      • tina

        Hi, I very much appreciate your points of discusssion. I am learning a lot. I am dating a Dutch guy, but I want to know more about your culture and the thing is, he’s a divorced guy. I respect him so much because he is probably the most honest and caring guy I ever knew so far. Now the problem is I kinda feel left out lately, because his ex-wife came to spend holidays with him and their children. I told him not to worry about me and to not bother sending me a message while they are away, unless he misses me. I feel like he doesn’t miss me at all and it hurts, but I don’t know how to tell him.

        • Well it sounds as if he took what you said literally. That he hasn’t been in touch with you doesn’t mean that he’s not interested, he’s just taken you at your word. I suggest that you wait till you see him again and explain to him that even though you said not to bother contacting you, that it would have been nice if he had. I’m not Dutch by the way 😀

          • tina

            Thanks Shallowman, very much appreciated your points. Yes I will definitely let him know how I’m feeling when he returns. It’s best to be honest. Thanks again.

  • Cris

    Although a lot of the points mentioned are true to some level, in the end it’s just a matter of understanding, right? Being an Asian, I have my ways too that I consider normal but turns out to be weird to other people. We all unknowingly have some weirdness, of course. Being married to a Dutch man, I have to say I’m glad I have a man who is HONEST since we were dating, so no big surprises anymore when we got married. Most find the directness as rude, but I actually appreciate the honesty. I like that he was NEVER late on our dates. We sometimes split the bill. It was a bit strange for me at first but then I realized I’d rather date someone like that than one who pretends to be able to pay for everything meanwhile his credit card debt is piling up. He is totally fine for us being equals, not like in the country where I come from where there’s the “macho” image of guys. Plus, I don’t have to keep up appearances by putting on tons of make up. He appreciates me make-up or no make-up. And when I ended up in the hospital for 3 weeks and needed months to recover at home, he never left my side. I would not have recovered without him. I do not know if it’s common to Dutch men, but I’ve never seen such loyalty.

  • Confused

    Is it possible to make a dutch guy jealous? I’m in a confusing relationship with a Dutch guy. We are long distance and he said even though I am not his gf yet but he want to wait till we meet and pick up from there but meanwhile he asked me not no have sext or sex with other guy and said he will do the same but at times he ignore my texts or calls.
    What I want to know if I told him I meet other guy here will it make him more determine or will it backfire?

    • Hi it will probably backfire. But as you’re having a long distance relationship I’d suggest that you go ahead but just don’t tell him. 😉

  • Bridge TAX

    Hey, I am from Singapore, I just had this experience w dutch handsome guy. I really wish he had the french influence of talk kissing. Totally stiff, n would love to give back that kiss me fur puppy.

  • Dutchie123456789

    I’m a Dutch girl and have dated multiple Dutch guys, all the above is nonsense. Except that you can’t show up in a dress and high heels like if you’re going to meet the queen, just wear jeans.

    • Hahahaha there you have it people. Proof that some Dutch women have zero fashion sense and are obsessed with wearing denim due to a total lack of creativity, or just outright laziness or the need to conform.

      • DK123

        Yes why always always jeans?!

  • jessy

    im a dutch girl but the fashion thing dosent aply to me at all.. i actually care what i wear >.< and dont want to be seen without my hair done properly… i dont like makeup tho.

  • Dawn Jen

    Dutch women are among the most beautiful you say – been giving the nod to Utah (the State) and the Dominican Republic – what say you

  • Jacqueline

    Dutch guys
    Pros: tall, slim, some of them are good looking, many are educated and well exposed and can talk about a range of topics, not possessive or chauvinistic
    Cons: stingy, self absorbed, tactless/cluelessly offensive, stiff, boring, poorly dressed, not manly (afraid of approaching girls), lazy (expect girls to chase them), immature expectations of relationships and commitment

  • kate

    So funny! Flemish or Belgian guys are not much different than Dutch. If you want a temporary boyfriend, I suggest the French are best as they are romantic and very sensitive to your needs but they will not stick around long (just use protection). The English are good too.

  • Dolph

    This is not very accurate, but I love your writing style.

  • Cece

    In other words Dutch men are like autistic feminine cowards

  • Pingback: Le plus beau mec du monde ? Néerlandais, bien sûr !? - Canal Dutch()

  • Sandrine Sabbagh

    Shallow man, I think you’re very harsh with dutch men. I sort of had this thing going on for a while with a dutch (wouldn’t call it a relationship either though).
    He definitely had this issue with money, had me pay for a whole week-end in Paris and I’ll spare you the details. Although I did find it particularly weird/ pathetic, I still think there were very positive things about him, due to him being dutch. Handsome (well, thin and tall), VERY straightforward, smooth and relaxed (some might describe it as cold, I disagree), great sense of humor, seemed to be very family oriented. I’m lebanese, so I’d wear dresses, heals and make-up (I’m rather “basic” compared to my culture of origin so not that much either, but still), and he did not seem to mind it. Although it was a definite failure, it still made me rather curious of the dutch than want to run the other way. There is something special about them.

  • 3_Rings_of_Doom

    After 14 years living in The Netherlands, and various attempts of dating Dutch man…I can say that it’s so true that it hurts! Of course Dutch man are going to say that it’s not true…of course they will…

    • 3_Rings_of_Doom

      And I forgot to comment about Dutch woman…yes they are dangerous and they go for what they want doesn’t matter if it’s her best friend husband…not a very trustful woman to have around if your boyfriend is cute and or have a nice job…again I know what I am talking about!! And in terms of working with them…oh man…I have so much to say about it…but for now it’s enough!

      • Chris James

        if you look anything like I do, you will never have to worry about being pursued by women as I’m considered one of the most ugliest looking men world-wide.
        saying that, I don’t get nearly as much hostility in the Netherlands as I do elsewhere in the world. I guess the fact that I’m a red headed man renders me off the even remotely desirable list, and that may just be 1 reason. maybe my face screams autism (I sadly do suffer with being an aspie)

        • There’s a lot of red-heads in the Netherlands so this shouldn’t prevent you from success in the dating field. As for autism, well if you’re familiar with Dutch directness, then you’ll know that the behavior of many is borderline autistic, so also not a problem. 😀

  • Ali Williams

    I love your blog. Brilliant!

    • Thank you Ali. Nice to receive compliments once in a blue moon. 😉

  • Chris James

    interesting read. maybe I could use some advice for meeting dutch women? though I may be physically too ugly looking facially to have a chance. the rest of the world judges me this way at the very least, but at least i’m safe to dance In some of the dutch bars that have great discotechs 😉 in the uk, people want to fight me for the way I dance (and spin round to good rhythmatic music). I’m wondering if I’m a long lost genetic from the Netherlands that got lost and stunted in height due to being born in the uk, as I have a good number of views of the dutch men also and one or 2 friends I have , have told me that I could pass for a low status dutch man (due to my shitty stunted well below average male height of 5’8 1’2 which is pitiful)